MPs and sex scandals

[purpletigron]

John Hemming has now made some public comments on his relationships.

Comments

[alexmc.livejournal.com]

Gosh.

[purpletigron.livejournal.com]

"Gosh!" that he's said anything, or "Gosh!" at something specific which he's said?

[alexmc.livejournal.com]

Just "Gosh".

I didnt know we had any openly poly MPs.

[purpletigron.livejournal.com]

We still don't know, without asking Emily Cox and Christine Hemming.

[fjm.livejournal.com]

Good Lord! A poly MP? Bet he lives (or lived) in Moseley.

[purpletigron.livejournal.com]

He's a Yardley (http://www.yardley.libdems.org.uk/john) boy.

Is he a poly boy? I would have to ask Christine Hemming and Emily Cox.

[fjm.livejournal.com]

Reading the original article in the The Times, he makes it clear that Christine has known about it for six years.

The Times says she wasn't thrilled, but she accepted it, and was only upset about Emily's pregnancy. As Hemmings says that Christine was misreported, it's all a bit unclear, but I don't see how he could have maintained a relationship that his wife knew about without at least her consent.

[purpletigron.livejournal.com]

Clearly, the women are informed, but I cannot say whether they are freely consenting.

[profundo-rosso.livejournal.com]

Many moons ago, a well-known British sf fan (and self-styled feminist) appeared on a morning chatshow with her male partner to advertise for another guy to join them in a three-way relationship. As proof that it could work, they pointed out that they'd both been in such triangles before - ignoring the obvious point that since both these previous dynamics had collapsed, maybe it wasn't so workable after all.

[purpletigron.livejournal.com]

Not sure what this has to do with Emily, John and Christine :-)

[the-maenad.livejournal.com]

Most relationships come apart sooner or later; 2-way, 3-way, 4-way, n-way. Any relationships needs the right people, and the right attitude, and the right amount of nurture and upkeep.

[fjm.livejournal.com]

Goshprofundo_rosso. You're quite right. And with all the divorce figures that *clearly* proves monogamy is doomed.

I always say, don't look at the number of break ups, look at the relationship between people after the break up. Most of my poly friends still socialise with their exes.

[redbird]

That proves nothing one way or the other, especially if you don't know how the previous triads ended: sometimes relationships end because of death. For that matter, we encourage people whose monogamous pairings end in acrimonious divorce to try again, not to conclude either that marriage is inherently unworkable, or that they specifically aren't suited for it.

[profundo-rosso.livejournal.com]

Golly, all this debauchery virtually on my doorstep. Could be an interesting test case: an MP who admits to a second relationship and asks the obvious question: so long as he hasn't been trading on the "stable family background" angle (cf. David Mellor, Cecil Parkinson), what the hell has this to do with his performance as a politician?

[yonmei.livejournal.com]

Depends. It means both the women involved will have to stay "on message" for the sake of his career - which, if they care for him at all, puts an appalling degree of emotional blackmail into it, just as the need for an MP's wife to "stand by him" did.

[profundo-rosso.livejournal.com]

Definitely. It may well be that such three-(or more)-cornered relationships can work, but those I've seen in action always left me suspecting at least one of those involved was less consenting than the others.

[purpletigron.livejournal.com]

Of course, there are some successful n-cornered relationships that you've not seen 'in action' :-)

[fjm.livejournal.com]

Hear Hear!

And why stop at three? Love is a many splendoured thing. I notice no-one has *dreamt* of asking Christine Hemmings whether the open relationship goes both ways.

[purpletigron.livejournal.com]

We have a saying in our family, which can be rendered something like: "As with chocolate biscuits, five is a great couple" :-)

And ... I've definitely dreamt of it ...

[purpletigron.livejournal.com]

If all three partners gave informed consent, then they might be able to stay 'on message' without emotional blackmail. If the relationships began with coercion, then I fear you are right.

[vgnwtch.livejournal.com]

There are so many ways for humans to screw up their romantic relationships without actual coercion - I've known people who've agreed to all manner of behaviours they don't like one little bit just because they want to hang on to their partners and believe this is the only way; or when partners assume that a particular term means the same to both of them, but it doesn't, and so on. You end up with massive resentment building up whenever you have miscommunication around really fundamental things like sex and money and who does what around the house. People get stuck in their misery, and before long, they don't know how to get out. Obviously, I'm making big assumptions, but the wife comes across as someone who agreed to her husband's affairs as a way of hanging on to him, not because she was emotionally OK with it (and this is my big, enormous set of emotional reactions to what I've seen printed, rather than actual knowledge); and that seems like a recipe for trouble.

Ah! The meaning of terms!

[purpletigron.livejournal.com]

who've agreed to all manner of behaviours they don't like one little bit just because they want to hang on to their partners

That, to me, is coercion. I consider simple agreement to be very different from informed consent. Information includes self-knowledge, such as any mis-match between intellectual and emotional acceptance.

the wife comes across as someone who agreed to her husband's affairs as a way of hanging on to him, not because she was emotionally OK with it

That's my concern. This would, to me, represent - implicit - coercion.

[purpletigron.livejournal.com]

In the public domain, we still only have hints that this might be different from normal political debauchery.

[vgnwtch.livejournal.com]

Do you remember, a few years back, a British MP/MEP being caught at customs with cocaine, handcuffs, and gay porn in his suitcase? He was on his way to Amsterdam to have sex with men, and his wife airily remarked that it was no-one's business but theirs, and why anyone thought it might be of interest entirely baffled her. It got dropped pretty quickly because they were both so blase about it all. I can't even remember the bloke's name, which shows how little attention got paid once the press realised there was no tearful betrayed spouse angle. I rather admired the couple's way of dealing with it. They may have had the most appalling marriage as far as I know, but they came across as perfectly happy.

[purpletigron.livejournal.com]

I don't recall, but I wish them all well...